Germany - VBL 1. Bundesliga 2017/2018

  • We are currently just guessing - of course now without Offenburg applying for first league license the second placed (also south) Straubing is eligible to do so even without wildcard. But it isn't clear, if they could/can sort out things especially financially. So we have to wait for next weak to learn for sure (remember, the Watt Volleys Husum wanted a wildcard for the men's season coming, but I heard/read nothing from them for more than half a year, so their state has to be clarified too).

  • I can't find any confirmation by Straubing, that they apply for first league license now - it's known, that they want principally try again, but not, if they "found" the money for it. But at least I asked them now on twitter :) .


    Regarding Köln: a few years ago they checked their chances to go to first league, and the result was, that they have no suitable hall available. At least their university hall is too small and for example the Lanxxess hall is far too big for a regular volleyball team (over 18.000 seats!).

  • https://www.stuttgarter-zeitun…a7-857f-c7e47b6fab5a.html


    Dresden...ohne Worte...Waibl and friends are a shame :down:


    There are several reasons for unfriendly behaviour, you should be aware of: in first season of Stuttgart in first league Alex Waibl was fired due (at least it was claimed for) an interview he gave. And I guess, that both Dresden and Schwerin see Stuttgart as newbies, who threaten their hegemony existing a few years ago... Don't take this too serious therefore.

  • There are several reasons for unfriendly behaviour, you should be aware of: in first season of Stuttgart in first league Alex Waibl was fired due (at least it was claimed for) an interview he gave. And I guess, that both Dresden and Schwerin see Stuttgart as newbies, who threaten their hegemony existing a few years ago... Don't take this too serious therefore.


    Wow, so you support Waibl in this case :white:


    In my opinion, it is just once more an example of the bad charackter Waibl has shown since he came to Dresden..unfortunately he has affected many Dresden's players...for example Myrthe Schoot's behaviour has changed in a bad way, after she started playing for Dresden under Waibl.

  • Wow, so you support Waibl in this case :white:


    In my opinion, it is just once more an example of the bad charackter Waibl has shown since he came to Dresden..unfortunately he has affected many Dresden's players...for example Myrthe Schoot's behaviour has changed in a bad way, after she started playing for Dresden under Waibl.


    No, I just wanted to put the statements into perspective. And by the way, in Schwerin they doesn't like Waibl at all; indeed, as head coach originating from Stuttgart he has some bonus by most of us here. His dismission in first 1st league season was not justified IMHO, additionally.

  • Today 19.30 CET live on http://www.vbl.tv: the first semifinal Stuttgart - Aachen :thumbup:


    Stuttgart is the clear favourite but I hope the Ladies in Black will put up a good fight and who knows, maybe they can even cause an upset...


    With the sole exception of the DVV cup semi final our Stuttgart team didn't let upsets happen this season by underdogs in home hall. And I don't think, that they will do Aachen the same favour as Wiesbaden than to underestimate them.

  • Some bad news from German leagues in general: too few teams work professionally to have a chance, to play finally first league, others lack suitable halls (second league North champions Köln - Cologne are an example, only too small or too big halls available in the fourth biggest city of Germany) or enough sponsor money in the foreseeable future (for example 80'ies five time German Champions Lohhof). Additionally Schwerin can't play Champions League anymore in its releatively new Palmberg hall and in Stuttgart it is not only considered being too expensive, but also inadequate regardings sports and chances compared to CEV cup - what is right principally, this was told by Stuttgarts team director Kim Renkema. So only Dresden is supposed to try to play in CL again, they will have to play qualification rounds (with solid chances this time) to get into pool stage, if the finals are as expected Stuttgart vs. Schwerin, but at least this coming season they can.

  • And Aachen takes set 1 :super:


    They could have had it even easier if they had a better OH than Oude Luttikhuis and if Bongaerts hadn't wasted some good scoring opportunities in the middle of the set with imprecisions. Luckily she didn't let it get to her and found back her connection with the hitters later.

  • Stuttgart takes a very emotional 3rd set but lost Teodora Pusic towards the end, apparently she hurt her ankle :S


    Aachen is doing really well overall, they just lack firepower at times, but the match is on a good level. :hit:


    EDIT Pusic is back in 4th set, so nothing serious.

  • Stuttgart - Aachen 3:1 (24:26 25:19 26:24 25:16)
    http://live.volleyball-bundesliga.de/2017-18/Women/2512.pdf
    MVP: Femke Stoltenborg / Kirsten Knip


    Aachen played well in 1st and 3rd set but doesn't have the consistency and options to play a full match on the same level as Stuttgart. After a weak 1st set Oude Luttikhuis turned out to be Aachen's strongest hitter :white: Both OPPs were awful and Adams played the worst match since she's in Aachen I guess. Stuttgart played solid but not outstanding, only Daalderop and towards the end McCage were impressive. And I have to say, today Stoltenborg clearly won the Dutch setters' battle.

  • Stuttgart - Aachen 3:1 (24:26 25:19 26:24 25:16)
    http://live.volleyball-bundesliga.de/2017-18/Women/2512.pdf
    MVP: Femke Stoltenborg / Kirsten Knip


    Aachen played well in 1st and 3rd set but doesn't have the consistency and options to play a full match on the same level as Stuttgart. After a weak 1st set Oude Luttikhuis turned out to be Aachen's strongest hitter :white: Both OPPs were awful and Adams played the worst match since she's in Aachen I guess. Stuttgart played solid but not outstanding, only Daalderop and towards the end McCage were impressive. And I have to say, today Stoltenborg clearly won the Dutch setters' battle.


    I totally agree.


    I think Oude Luttikkhuis played her best (in all elements) and Adams het worst match for Aachen ever. Aachen's best players during the season (Adams and Bongaerts) had an off-day today.


    After the match, the stream continued and I saw Jamie Morrison talking with Erik Reitsma (Aachen's assistent-coach)..so I think all Dutch players were very motivated.


    It is indeed a pity Aachen has no options on bench if necessary and in general only 11 players in roster. It's all a matter of money. The only real substitute is Kalinovskaya (MB).

  • Especially the first set was a lousy performance by Stuttgart, and nevertheless a very lucky set win by Aachen, which clearly performed above their standards in first set. Stuttgart had no rhythm in beginning, especially not in service, with 6 service faults in the both first sets each. This referee should be suspended by VBL, beause he isn't able to count to four, both wrong decisions in this regard against Stuttgart (first fourth contact of Aachen was not decided as error, and later a third contact action by Stuttgart was decided as four times contact - I have never witnessed such a nonsense and incompetence at all).


    Anyway, a typical underdog nothing to lose approach match - remember, that Aachen was new in first league 10 years ago now together with Stuttgart and is still not having a rule conforming hall. Wiesbaden had to bear much harder pressure in the past regarding hall, and was nearly excluded from the first league a few years ago for this reason. The extreme patience of the VBL with Aachen can only be understood by the lack of first league license applications. In other words, IMHO Aachen doesn't have any right to go to finals under these circumstances, but this is in the eye of the beholder of course.

  • Especially the first set was a lousy performance by Stuttgart, and nevertheless a very lucky set win by Aachen, which clearly performed above their standards in first set. Stuttgart had no rhythm in beginning, especially not in service, with 6 service faults in the both first sets each. This referee should be suspended by VBL, beause he isn't able to count to four, both wrong decisions in this regard against Stuttgart (first fourth contact of Aachen was not decided as error, and later a third contact action by Stuttgart was decided as four times contact - I have never witnessed such a nonsense and incompetence at all).


    Anyway, a typical underdog nothing to lose approach match - remember, that Aachen was new in first league 10 years ago now together with Stuttgart and is still not having a rule conforming hall. Wiesbaden had to bear much harder pressure in the past regarding hall, and was nearly excluded from the first league a few years ago for this reason. The extreme patience of the VBL with Aachen can only be understood by the lack of first league license applications. In other words, IMHO Aachen doesn't have any right to go to finals under these circumstances, but this is in the eye of the beholder of course.



    Aachen has a very good image in Bundesliga because of the friendly atmosphere; all teams really like to play in Neuköllner Strasse. According tot the budget-ranking, Aachen is punching above their weight. This performance is recognised by many bundesweit.


    Why should Aachen be punished for not having a modern gym? The games are played in Maaseik, so there is no single reason to complain.

  • Aachen has a very good image in Bundesliga because of the friendly atmosphere; all teams really like to play in Neuköllner Strasse. According tot the budget-ranking, Aachen is punching above their weight. This performance is recognised by many bundesweit.


    Why should Aachen be punished for not having a modern gym? The games are played in Maaseik, so there is no single reason to complain.


    Yes, I was once also there in this small hall, it has a great atmosphere. But it is also economically not fair in comparison to teams like Wiesbaden and Suhl for the following reason: those below-the-standards halls are much cheaper than bigger ones. For example, when Stuttgart shifted from the school sports hall in Stuttgart-Vaihingen to the new SCHARRena in Bad Cannstatt (the other side of the city) already in 2011, seven years ago, hall costs per matchday exploded by a factor 100 (no kidding!). Because even a relatively big school sports hall you can rent here for 60 Euro per match day, while professional SCHARRena costs the club 6.000 Euro per match day (all kinds of costs included), which has a considerable impact on the budget - and you can't compensate with more (expensive) tickets, you will have much higher net costs after the change. I'm still wondering, how Polish clubs can afford those big halls they play in (often for about 10.000 spectators), because we used once the much bigger Porsche hall in Stuttgart for the record breaking match in spring 2016 with 5.400 spectators (capacity 6.100), which costs usually in the raw 15.000 Euro per matchday, not included parasitic costs like current, security, gastronomy and so on... it was only possible, because if you are lucky and nobody rented the hall at such a date before, you can do it a little cheaper than normal. So hall costs are no minor aspect economically (I don't know, if you read, that Polish champions Chemik Police left for this season the big Azoty hall in Stettin, when the rent was highered considerably).

  • Anyway, a typical underdog nothing to lose approach match - remember, that Aachen was new in first league 10 years ago now together with Stuttgart and is still not having a rule conforming hall. Wiesbaden had to bear much harder pressure in the past regarding hall, and was nearly excluded from the first league a few years ago for this reason. The extreme patience of the VBL with Aachen can only be understood by the lack of first league license applications. In other words, IMHO Aachen doesn't have any right to go to finals under these circumstances, but this is in the eye of the beholder of course.


    It is a little bit difficult with the volleyball hall in Aachen.


    First problem: the money


    If I remember well Suhl got about 1,5 or 2 Million Euros from the State of Thuringia to
    upgrade their hall in Suhl. As far as I know Aachen has no chance to get such funding in Northrine-Westphalia.


    Second problem: the location


    There were ideas to build an additional big sport hall at „Richardstraße“ to generally improve the situation of school sport and club sports before the LiB rised to the 1th league . After the rise of the LiB, there were doubts about this location – it would not match the needs of the LiB because of a lack of parking space. The idea was abandoned for other reasons: politics did not want to give up one of only two green areas in the inner city of Aachen (inside „Alleenring“) to build the hall there. Otherwise there would have been massive protests I presume.


    As the next step it was necessary to check the upgrading of „Neuköllner Straße“. The LiB-Hall has problems with its roof not only because it is too low. The construction of the roof is similar to the roof of the „Eislaufhalle Bad Reichenhall“ crashing in 2006 under the burden of snow. That‘s not that big problem because there is usually not much snow in Aachen, but it would have been a big omission not to check, if it is possible to solve both problems by one action. The plans were abandoned because of the costs beeing not as low as supposed. Moreover the hall would have to be extended because of the insufficient space for visitors.


    In the preliminary „Flächennutzungsplan“ an area near „Strangenhäuschen“ south of the „Autobahn“ to the Netherlands is planned for a sports hall.


    But the next plans contain a hall for the volleyball in the „Sportpark Soers“ area in the north of Aachen, where the new „Tivoli“ football stadium and the „CHIO-area“ are located. CHIO is the world equestrian festival organized once a year in Aachen by the „Aachen-Laurensberger Rennverein“ (ALRV).


    In the „Sportpark Soers“ there are three positions where the new hall could be located:


    The southern location was opposed by the neighbors living there because of the noise. A second problem is, that parts of an area are needed which is used by the „Eisenbahnsportverein Aachen“ and owned by the „Eisenbahnbundesamt“. The realization ist not very probable.


    The middle location was probably favorite of politics. But this area is used by the ALRV for the CHIO. The ALRV always complains about a lack of space for the CHIO and wants to get more ground.


    The northern location would be on the area of the police headquarters in Aachen. The police headquarters built in the
    70s is dilapidated and will be replaced by a new building elsewhere in Aachen. The police will move in spring 2019. If police has left the area the city of Aachen may succeed in bying the ground from the State of Northrine-Westphalia.
    The police headquarters area is the only possibility to enlarge the CHIO area.
    The police area has about 33.000 m² and offers space enough to build a sports hall too. May be the ALRV gives up some ground at the middle location to build the hall there if he gets more space in the north.


    Last year, a new problem appeared. The „Lindt & Sprüngli“ company (not so unknown) with german seat and production in Aachen announced that they want to enlarge their production. Very good because of taxes and jobs. There is not so much industry left in Aachen. And there are jobs at „Lindt & Sprüngli“ for people who are not so high educated! You can‘t let „Lindt & Sprüngli“ move away from Aachen.
    But „Lindt & Sprüngli“ need to enlarge their factory site and want to take over the „Bendplatz“ south of their area. At the Bendplatz two funfairs a year take place, circusses appear and so on. Where can the Bendplatz (about 40.000 m²) be replaced? May be only by using the police area? So there would be no space left for a new sports hall!


    A new idea was to build a volleyball hall using and renovating parts of the so called „Jahrhunderthalle“, an old industrial building in the northeast of Aachen. There might have been financial benefits if getting urban development funds by the state of Northrine-Westphalia.
    But the plan was abandoned in the meantime. May be it is not possible to have space for 2.000 up to 2.500 visitors in this hall, may be this would be possible but too expansive? May be it would be very expansive because the only parts
    of the building suitable for volleyball are those parts in the worst condition.


    Newer Informations from the newspapers say that the city of Aachen is going to buy the „Camp Hitfeld“ area to get more industrial grounds. May be this way a solution for „Lindt & Sprüngli“ and the Bendplatz can be found without using the police headquarters area. But concerning „Camp Hitfeld“ there are problems too: legal disputes and it is an old area of the Belgian army which has to be dekontaminated (at high costs?).
    But buying the ground the city of Aachen obviously plans to use it. If they succeed it might be possible to build the new volleyball hall in the northern oder medium area of „Sportpark Soers“ when the old police headquarters is torn down.


    I hope I could make the situation in Aachen more understandable by this short overview?

  • Yes, this makes Aachens difficult hall situation more transparent. But the VBL is supposed to set a time limit for LiB until they have to use solely a rule-conforming hall, I simply doesn't know in which year this limit is reached - I suppose, it should be reached already or in near future. Maybe already next or the season afterwards they require this. We will learn, when checking of first league license applications is done and results are presented, I think.