Russian NT 2016

  • Jaqueline was once caught in doping, a serious one. So now because of that I should assume Murilo is out, not cause he is injuried or whatever, but must be cause he is not clean as well, after all it is in the family history? Is it that different...honestly.....

    I can't believe you're using these examples, really, this is too much for me!
    Brazil IS NOT going through a major doping scandal right now, and has never been. Jaqueline used freaking green tea and Murilo is INJURIED for years now, haven't played the last two weeks in World league. How can you say that he "is injuried or whatever". It's NOT whatever, he is injuried and we all know that.
    Saying that Startseva getting cut in the last few days and being replaced by someone most people never even heard of is the same is Murilo getting cut is outrageous.

  • What about Brazil's athletics? They also discovered not so long ago a huge doping scheme in all brazilian athletics, not one or two athletes...what about that....If we start accusing everyone just by assuptions.....God save sports...

    Is this happening right now? Are these athletes competing right now?


    I will make any assumptions I want, because I read about the doping scandal in Russia everyday and it is really huge.

  • I'm sorry, but the analogy with corruption or terrorism doesn't apply here. The IOC has said that "the presumption of innocence of Russian athletes was being put seriously into question" after the report that came out last week. Doping in Russia it's a systemic problem and a scheme was planned and sponsored by the Russian government.

    Also, at least 8 positive doping results from Russian volleyball players had been hid in the last 4 years. So, of course we can't say for sure that Gamova, Startseva or whatever definitely was used doping, but speculate about it makes sense.


  • Oh, you really didnt get my point in there....I know Murilo is injuried, dont worry...Im not accusing them of anything. :wavy:

  • I can't believe you're using these examples, really, this is too much for me!
    Brazil IS NOT going through a major doping scandal right now, and has never been. Jaqueline used freaking green tea and Murilo is INJURIED for years now, haven't played the last two weeks in World league. How can you say that he "is injuried or whatever". It's NOT whatever, he is injuried and we all know that.
    Saying that Startseva getting cut in the last few days and being replaced by someone most people never even heard of is the same is Murilo getting cut is outrageous.


    I'm sorry, but the analogy with corruption or terrorism doesn't apply here. The IOC has said that "the presumption of innocence of Russian athletes was being put seriously into question" after the report that came out last week. Doping in Russia it's a systemic problem and a scheme was planned and sponsored by the Russian government.

    Also, at least 8 positive doping results from Russian volleyball players had been hid in the last 4 years. So, of course we can't say for sure that Gamova, Startseva or whatever definitely was used doping, but speculate about it makes sense.


    Ok, you can speculate, of course, Im just saying I would not like if people were speculating about me, me being clean, and not corrupt or whatever analogy you prefer... :thumbup:

  • Jaqueline's case is very diffent: she was positive to a test because of a cellulite cream.


    We are talking about a statal doping case. Russia should be banned from the next OGs. That's all. Doping is doping. I don't care it's mendolium or something stronger. It's an etichal matter.

  • Ok, you can speculate, of course, Im just saying I would not like if people were speculating about me, me being clean, and not corrupt or whatever analogy you prefer... :thumbup:

    As I said before, if you were a Brazilian politician, in Brazil, I would definetly speculate about you. The doping scandal in Russia is the case right now. If you can't understand an analogy, then it's not my problem :wavy:

  • I insist . Russia should had been banned from rio .
    And of course every time I see a Russian athlete , doubts will cross my mind . In fact , every time I see a Russian athlete competing in whichever element I'll be rooting for the opposite team for sure .
    What Russian federation has done is disgusting ...

  • Jaqueline's case is very diffent: she was positive to a test because of a cellulite cream.

    Yep, sure. The babies are brought by storks, Puff the Magic Dragon still lives by the Sea and there's no doubt that Santa Klaus exists.


    I insist . Russia should had been banned from rio .
    And of course every time I see a Russian athlete , doubts will cross my mind . In fact , every time I see a Russian athlete competing in whichever element I'll be rooting for the opposite team for sure .
    What Russian federation has done is disgusting ...

    Fully agree. Once those russkies gave the asylum to Ed Snowden, my cat has been having diarrhea.
    What I seriously hope about is that IOC ends this run of host nations being the Olympic winners - you know, all this blah-blah about home crowd and friendly climate.

  • Im not saying she is clean, I honestly dont know....Im just saying that now everything is doping for Russia athletes...and I think it is not right to assume that without proof.


    Jaqueline was once caught in doping, a serious one. So now because of that I should assume Murilo is out, not cause he is injuried or whatever, but must be cause he is not clean as well, after all it is in the family history? Is it that different...honestly.....


    So if we go from there, why should there is still cycling in Olympics? Lance revealed a major doping scheme in the sport. What about Brazil's athletics? They also discovered not so long ago a huge doping scheme in all brazilian athletics, not one or two athletes...what about that....If we start accusing everyone just by assuptions.....God save sports...


    The problem is those are individual athletes. They did it by themselves. It is a completely different case by Russia because it js a state-sponsored doping programme. There are 8 people on Russian NT that were tested positive compared to one people (Jaque) on the Brasil NT and it was during Superliga.


    And gurl please. Everyone knows Murilo is out because of his injuries. It was played in front of the entire world. Unlike Murseskiy and Startseva. Tell me how can you cut off your best back up setter, the best setter of the London Olympics out of the blue? What's the reason behind that?


    And stop reaching cancellng the cycling sports. Based on your logics we should cancel athletic from the Olympic because Russian team is banned because of this scandal.


    There are reasonable thoughts behind these whole assumptions that players are getting cut off out of nothing because of the drugs scandal.

  • I feel frustated to be honest with so many people thinking Russia as a nation should be banned from this OG or the next one.

    YES the whole scandal it's disgusting and all the guilties should be punished, but if there is one clean, this person should NEVER EVER be punished by others mistakes.


    We as person and society may not agree with so many things, but somethings we just can't change it, only do ours part. So i can understand an athlete having knowledge of bad things but stay quiet and be fair to yourself just.


    Well, good that IOC did the right decision and not acted considering politics.

  • What they have done is a systematic and communal crime! That's why punishment also should be communal. I think most people are not aware of the severity of the issue and how this case is different than an ordinary individual doping usage.


    Although Russian team would be a strong asset to OG, I belıeve that IOC should stick with his principles and ban all athlete from OG. Without such a deterrent punishment, nobody can guarantee that this shameful crime would not be repeated :down:

  • I'm not sure what I think the punishment for this should be. I initially thought Russia should be banned from Rio, but now I'm not sure. For me, the question is less about punishing them, and more about whether or not they QUALIFIED for the Olympics with two or more players using performance enhancing drugs.


    If so, then yes, I think they should probably be retroactively disqualified from their qualification tournament, thereby eliminating them from Rio, and another team should take their place. If not, then I think mandating that the "positive" athletes stay home is sufficient.


    Also, it's hard for me to understand how accurate the McLaren report is. If officials dressed as plumbers were actually passing clean urine samples to athletes through holes in the wall, then who cares about the 8 athletes that tested positive? And further, how DID they test positive?? Like, if they tested positive, wouldn't that kind of undermine the veracity of the McLaren Report, which makes this system sound super airtight?

  • I'm amazed of how people rather to ramble over such a sensitive topic like doping is. Russia should not be at the Olympics and that's all. At the same time what this situation reflects is also the lack of leadership from the IOC by not having a tough hand towards Russian Federation. Again, its very simple, what Russians have done , is a CRIME, which they have gotten away with... :thumbdown::thumbdown::thumbdown:

  • I'm amazed of how people rather to ramble over such a sensitive topic like doping is. Russia should not be at the Olympics and that's all. At the same time what this situation reflects is also the lack of leadership from the IOC by not having a tough hand towards Russian Federation. Again, its very simple, what Russians have done , is a CRIME, which they have gotten away with... :thumbdown: :thumbdown: :thumbdown:

    Russia has committed a crime but so has other countries. Tell me what you think of these stories? Perhaps you should support your views with facts instead of rambling naively about how bad Russia and only Russia is. And the McLaren report is based on ONE guy's CLAIMS without full evidence. This Dr Rodchenkov also made doping claims against several top British athletes but those claims were brushed aside. Why choose to believe him only now?


    https://www.theguardian.com/sp…anmackay?CMP=share_btn_fb


    Carl Lewis has broken his silence on allegations that he was the beneficiary of a drugs cover-up, admitting he had tested positive for banned substances but claiming he was just one of "hundreds" of American athletes who were allowed to escape bans.




    http://www.insidethegames.biz/…ion-puerto-doping-scandal



    "In April 2013, the Criminal Court of Madrid ordered the destruction of the blood and plasma bags - a decision that WADA appealed in May 2013."




    https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport…it-athletes-banned-drugs/



    These examples all involve some coverup story involving the officials. But until now they are not investigated fully. Why? My point is that if you paint all Russian athletes with the same brush then you should paint every country with that same brush. Until that happens, I will give Russia's clean athletes the benefit of the doubt. The double standards into deciding which countries are to be investigated is what I dislike.


    WADA needs to reveal the names ASAP and stop all the speculation mess. And for those who gives names of athletes without, just be careful ok. It can be used for defamation litigations by athletes themselves. So better not to reveal names without some article backing you up.

  • The Russians for the past year are tested by UKAD and not by RUSADA. And for the volleyball players, they were tested mainly in Germany. That means that whoever was tested OUTSIDE of Russia fulfils the criteria that they are OUT of that Russian system. That is the criteria set by IOC. How difficult is that for people to understand? And the Russians who will go will undergo more tests under the supervision of FIVB and WADA themselves in the next 2 weeks. If they are clean, they are clean.


    https://www.olympic.org/news/d…he-olympic-games-rio-2016



    1. The IOC will not accept any entry of any Russian athlete in the Olympic Games Rio 2016 unless such athlete can meet the conditions set out below.
    2. Entry will be accepted by the IOC only if an athlete is able to provide evidence to the full satisfaction of his or her International Federation (IF) in relation to the following criteria:
    • The IFs*, when establishing their pool of eligible Russian athletes, to apply the World Anti-Doping Code and other principles agreed by the Olympic Summit (21 June 2016).
    • The absence of a positive national anti-doping test cannot be considered sufficient by the IFs.
    The IFs should carry out an individual analysis of each athlete’s anti-doping record, taking into account only reliable adequate international tests, and the specificities of the athlete’s sport and its rules, in order to ensure a level playing field.
    The IFs to examine the information contained in the IP Report, and for such purpose seek from WADA the names of athletes and National Federations (NFs) implicated. Nobody implicated, be it an athlete, an official, or an NF, may be accepted for entry or accreditation for the Olympic Games.
    • The IFs will also have to apply their respective rules in relation to the sanctioning of entire NFs.
    3. The ROC is not allowed to enter any athlete for the Olympic Games Rio 2016 who has ever been sanctioned for doping, even if he or she has served the sanction.
    4. The IOC will accept an entry by the ROC only if the athlete’s IF is satisfied that the evidence provided meets conditions 2 and 3 above and if it is upheld by an expert from the CAS list of arbitrators appointed by an ICAS Member, independent from any sports organisation involved in the Olympic Games Rio 2016.
    5. The entry of any Russian athlete ultimately accepted by the IOC will be subject to a rigorous additional out-of-competition testing programme in coordination with the relevant IF and WADA. Any non-availability for this programme will lead to the immediate withdrawal of the accreditation by the IOC.


    So basically: 1. they can't have a past history of doping. FYI that rule is against CAS and WADA's own rule which says that you can't ban an athlete who has served his ban previously. 2. Then the athletes names will checked by WADA and FIVB to ensure that this athlete has be tested adequately INTERNATIONALLY. 3. The names and their profiles will then be vetted by the court of arbitration for sport (CAS).



    I wish this applied to every country and for future Olympics. I'm glad IOC will restructure its own system. Following this rule, track and field will lose half of its participants though :D

  • Vetrova for Startseva is okay considering Startseva's performance this year. But why is Ezhova in the team? She isn't even the second best libera... Shcherban will have to get a lot of balls...


    As for the doping problem. I really don't like how the IOC and other sport federations are handling it. Why ban the Track and Field team but not the rest? Why apply rules only for Russian athletes (a lot of athletes can go to Rio even tough they tested positive in the past)? Other nations with "dubious" practices (Kenia, Jamaika, Turkey, several eastern european and central asian countries) are not punished. I am not saying that Russia is clean (far from it) but Russia seems to be the target more often than others (first Medonium now this)...

  • I agree on comments saying OG without Russia will be not the same however do we really want to see this Russian NT competing in volleyball for OG? No Gamova, no Startseva, most likely Kosha spending tournament on bench and probably a lot more we don't know. Marichev is a joke but he is not stupid. Why would he pick a setter spending her all season at bench instead of 2 setters who played CL during the season? I am not really sure but maybe Russian volleyball federation made a recent test to all potential NT members and eliminated the ones with the positive results which limited Marichev's choices. One last word, I don't expect any kind of medal from this Russian team, not because they are bad but they are mentally down knowing all these rumours behind the scenes :down: