Turkey- VVSL-Vestel Venus Women's League 2017/2018

  • Jeez, why wasting your time on arguing in Christmas? :aww:
    If he doesn’t like her, it’s his preference, you can’t change it nor make the Chinese lady less good. Why care so much? I don’t follow Turkish league at all these days so I barely read this thread but I don’t want this forum to be full of ridiculously endless conflicts. If you like the Chinese, that’s good and everybody knows she’s a great player but it doesn’t mean everyone despeately MUST like her, it you see my point.

  • This 'SHAME-bashing' is really unfair. He is perfectly entitled not to like a player. I could disagree with him if he would say Zhu is a bad player. This is an opinion and other people could give arguments to rebut his point. However, he just says he doesn't like Zhu, which is a preference and no one has anything to say about it. For instance, I really like players with strong jump servers, that's why my favourite players are Cubans generally. That's why watching Boskoviç or Egonu (even Yanelis Santos) is more pleasure than watching Zhu. And since this is a matter of taste, no one should criticize that.


    By the way, the only secret agenda going on here is that people keep calling Zhu Ting as by far best player in the world just to provoke other forum users


    Usually, when I have an opinion on someone or on something, I usually have facts and rational explanations to backup my opinion. When I don't like someone, I usually have no problem to explain explicitly WHY. As I said earlier, when you keep saying you don't like someone but unable to factually and rationally explain why, and you keep party pooping and blindly criticize this person, it's not an opinion anymore, but it's more like a hatred or harassment.



    Tell me one Turkish setter on the market that can replace Naz?

    There are full of international players can replace Naz. Also tell me how many players can make a high probability kill when she receive an awkward set from Naz ??

  • Only problem if they replace Naz with a International setter, they must replace either Rasic or Sloetjes with a Local Player.


    Only Eda could replace Rasic and maybe Mereym to replace Sloetjes. No other options when it comes to local players.

  • Tell me one Turkish setter on the market that can replace Naz?

    btw, do you remember who saved the Vakifbank's ass when the team were beating badly by Vitra 2:0 set, 20/10 ??? It was not Naz. To be frank, If Guidetti gives more plays time to Ozbay Cansus, she has no problem to replace Naz any time.

  • No coach in their right minds would take Naz over Zhu Ting. :rolll:


    I believe great female setters are rare nowadays. Fofao, Takeshita and Feng-Kun are probably repulsed in their retiree beds if someone told them that they are compared to Naz :rolll: . In my opinion Wei(probably retired),Maja and Nootsara are probably the last of the most famous creative female setters left in the international scene. It's now all about speed or having the crew who could make good reception or kill the ball when necessarry. This is why I find the women's volleyball unexciting with the current crop of setters we have. The plays are almost the same. If you are excited of what become of women's volleyball... I have nothing to say but pity. :whistle:


    This generation is only exciting me because Zhu Ting is unreal. The players will have to play catch up to her greatness or she will break a lot of hearts each time they met in the opposite side of the court. :whistle:

    Favorite players: M: Maxim Mikhaylov, Murilo, Serginho, Aaron Russell, Otavio, Simone Giannelli, Ivan Zaytsev, Tsvetan Sokolov, Michał Kubiak, Mariusz Wlazly, Pawel Zagummy W: Sheilla, Zhu Ting, Natalia, Fe Garay, Fofao, Gabi, Thaisa, Foluke Akinradewo, Wei Qiuyue, Ding Xia, Carli Lloyd, Fabi, Natalia Goncharova, Yuko Sano, Saoris Kimura and Sakoda

  • If he doesn’t like her, it’s his preference, you can’t change it nor make the Chinese lady less good. Why care so much? I don’t follow Turkish league at all these days so I barely read this thread but I don’t want this forum to be full of ridiculously endless conflicts. If you like the Chinese, that’s good and everybody knows she’s a great player but it doesn’t mean everyone despeately MUST like her, it you see my point.

    Yeah... we should instead criticize player's jersey or players haircuts or stadium music like you regularly do. Your contribution is so helpful.

  • Sometimes a team needs different things to become winners...


    If there's an example to be had... Let's say Russia with weak reception but with strong wing hitters... They badly need a great setter.


    You can't deny Vakifbank is a complete team but what makes them really unique is the ability of Zhu Ting to receive which frees the opposite when she successfully receives a ball... If the pass is struggling... because she's better than Sloetjes in attack... They can take her out and improve the reception with an outside hitter who could hit 2 and still receive. That's something other clubs do not have a luxury when they need to change tactics... Sometimes it doesn't work as good as Vakifbank because the player is not that stable as Zhu Ting.

    Favorite players: M: Maxim Mikhaylov, Murilo, Serginho, Aaron Russell, Otavio, Simone Giannelli, Ivan Zaytsev, Tsvetan Sokolov, Michał Kubiak, Mariusz Wlazly, Pawel Zagummy W: Sheilla, Zhu Ting, Natalia, Fe Garay, Fofao, Gabi, Thaisa, Foluke Akinradewo, Wei Qiuyue, Ding Xia, Carli Lloyd, Fabi, Natalia Goncharova, Yuko Sano, Saoris Kimura and Sakoda

    Edited 2 times, last by Rains_of_Castamere ().

  • Yeah... we should instead criticize player's jersey or players haircuts or stadium music like you regularly do. Your contribution is so helpful.


    His contribution is infinitely more interesting and useful than comments such as "Zhu Ting scored 728 points and that's why she's by far the best in the world and I'll post 30 more stats to further prove my point and everyone who doesn't say exactly the same is a jealous hater and probably racist". Because post(s) like THAT is what started this mess in the first place.


    Praising a player is perfectly normal. Rubbing it into people's faces (like paraphrased above) is annoying, but it's something one can live with. But, when it's combined with fighting a virtual war against imaginary enemies and "haters" when in fact there wasn't a single even remotely negative comment about Zhu Ting, that's when it becomes too much.

  • Zhu Ting-age 23


    Just ZHUper....




    Maybe Zhu was the MVP of the final but all the Vakif team was very good esp Naz and Gozde even Kelsey when she was in the court was positive and i believe that she will fit better in the team than K.H...Guidetti will find her a role....

  • btw, do you remember who saved the Vakifbank's ass when the team were beating badly by Vitra 2:0 set, 20/10 ??? It was not Naz. To be frank, If Guidetti gives more plays time to Ozbay Cansus, she has no problem to replace Naz any time.


    His contribution is infinitely more interesting and useful than comments such as "Zhu Ting scored 728 points and that's why she's by far the best in the world and I'll post 30 more stats to further prove my point and everyone who doesn't say exactly the same is a jealous hater and probably racist". Because post(s) like THAT is what started this mess in the first place.


    Praising a player is perfectly normal. Rubbing it into people's faces (like paraphrased above) is annoying, but it's something one can live with. But, when it's combined with fighting a virtual war against imaginary enemies and "haters" when in fact there wasn't a single even remotely negative comment about Zhu Ting, that's when it becomes too much.


    I hope you know that your post is not going to ease up the tension in here. :rolll:


    It's not helping to change his mind because you are doing exactly the same thing he is talking about. :gone:


    Sometimes... it's your own initiative to stop it you want people to stop talking about Zhu Ting.


    It will end eventually if we all stop upping one another on who is right or wrong.


    Jesus it is the holidays. :white: Chill :win:

    Favorite players: M: Maxim Mikhaylov, Murilo, Serginho, Aaron Russell, Otavio, Simone Giannelli, Ivan Zaytsev, Tsvetan Sokolov, Michał Kubiak, Mariusz Wlazly, Pawel Zagummy W: Sheilla, Zhu Ting, Natalia, Fe Garay, Fofao, Gabi, Thaisa, Foluke Akinradewo, Wei Qiuyue, Ding Xia, Carli Lloyd, Fabi, Natalia Goncharova, Yuko Sano, Saoris Kimura and Sakoda

  • This off topic is still going on! :wall:


    ST2008
    You must be the one and only person left here who doesn't understand what I say since always. Last answer, then I won't repeit this anymore. I never said Zhu Ting sucks, I just said she's an all about spiking player, which is simply what I see when she plays and what stats shows. This is not the kind of players I like as OHs, so I don't like her, that's all. I've been the first who said China was going to kick everyone else's asses in the 2016 because Lang Ping built a powerhouse, while Kiraly could just talk about breathing and yoga to his players. Still Zhu Ting won more matches in one single season with Vakifbank than in her entire career with Henan. She's no God. She can't win game by herself. Whenever you take out the players who make her game comfortable, the ones who do the dark job around her, she's just a good player. Lang Ping and Guidetti know how to make her work inside a system, which means she can't go anywhere alore. In the recent years the only player I saw winning by herlself more than one game is KYK and this makes her to my eyes the best player in the world. She is the OUTSIDE HITTER. She can pass, serve, spike and digg amazingly and she's a decent blocker. Zhu Ting can't pass the ball against strong serving teams. She scores always and forever, which is something good for her team, no doubt, simply I don't like this kind of game.


    Her passing against Fenerbahce: 7 attempts, 1 error, 0% positive, 0% perfect
    Her passing against Eczacibasi: 15 attempts, 15% positive, 8% perfect


    @Rains_of_Castamere
    Please, don't put into my mouth words I never said. I never asked Zhu Ting to cover 8m of court as passer, I just expect her to cover her 3 ones, which is something she can't do. And I never said I like Kosheleva for her skills. I just like her fighting spirit and the fact she doesn't even look russian when she plays her heart out with the eye of the tiger. Same for Gamova, when she used to play OH without passing; the only thing I liked about her for years was her kiss under the net to Dumler after blocking her. I could say the same about Rahimova, who's a player I simply love when she plays opposite, or Brayelin Martinez, or Bethania de la Cruz and so on. The player can be called Kara Zor-El, if she plays OH and she can't pass, I just won't like her.


    I live in country which guarantees the freedom of speech, so I'm free to write whatever I want as long as I respect the rules of the forum and I share my opinion with education. I wasn't even here in the last days and the Zhu Ting fans club started insulting me for no reason. Just like I respect the fact you love Zhu Ting, no matter what; you should respect the fact I don't like her. If you can't, this forum has no reason to exist anymore. I'm done with personal insults. The whole staff will take its measures for this umbelievable behavior. 10 years here and nothing like this never happened.


    Said this, as a moderator I tell you that whoever keeps this off topic going on will take the responsability of what he writes. This shameful page has to stop now. Move on.

    "Voglio i tuoi occhi quando sognerai per farmi rimanere qui"
    "...come la terra la pioggia d'estate"
    "Io ti ho coperto le spalle, scoprendo tutto il mio cuore"
    - Emma :heart::love:

    Edited once, last by SHAME ().

  • His contribution is infinitely more interesting and useful than comments such as "Zhu Ting scored 728 points

    Well if you think his appreciation of player's jersey or player's haircuts or stadium music has infinite contribution of to volleyball than a player statistic, I'm more than fine with this. But next time, try at least ask your buddy SHAME to find something factual and rational to explain why he doesn't like some specific players. It's funny that when SHAME uttering a bunch of verbiages, you call these an Opinion. But when people are questioning the validity of his bullshit, those people become SHAME-basher.

  • I re-watched Zhu's perf. through the video above
    Do you think a better defensive libero (e.g. an italian libero) could have saved a few of Zhu's diagonal spikes ?
    Bcz Libero Simge saved none of them


    Larson saved the spikes?
    As for the passing abilities of Zhu maybe she s not the best but in the olympics was
    BEST RECEIVERS Rank #3 : 39.68

  • No. Zhu Ting uses technique. She's not dumb


    What they need to do is to obviously block her and defend deeper. Hope whenever she tips the ball... they would get it.


    This is exactly why a team with second liberos makes a bigger impact than a libero.


    What really gets me is her ability to kill the ball from the backrow. Just too many points earned even with a triple block. At that point just skip the triple and make everyone defend her if you cannot form a well-timed triple block on her.

    Favorite players: M: Maxim Mikhaylov, Murilo, Serginho, Aaron Russell, Otavio, Simone Giannelli, Ivan Zaytsev, Tsvetan Sokolov, Michał Kubiak, Mariusz Wlazly, Pawel Zagummy W: Sheilla, Zhu Ting, Natalia, Fe Garay, Fofao, Gabi, Thaisa, Foluke Akinradewo, Wei Qiuyue, Ding Xia, Carli Lloyd, Fabi, Natalia Goncharova, Yuko Sano, Saoris Kimura and Sakoda

  • No coach in their right minds would take Naz over Zhu Ting. :rolll:


    I believe great female setters are rare nowadays. Fofao, Takeshita and Feng-Kun are probably repulsed in their retiree beds if someone told them that they are compared to Naz :rolll: . In my opinion Wei(probably retired),Maja and Nootsara are probably the last of the most famous creative female setters left in the international scene. It's now all about speed or having the crew who could make good reception or kill the ball when necessarry. This is why I find the women's volleyball unexciting with the current crop of setters we have. The plays are almost the same. If you are excited of what become of women's volleyball... I have nothing to say but pity. :whistle:


    This generation is only exciting me because Zhu Ting is unreal. The players will have to play catch up to her greatness or she will break a lot of hearts each time they met in the opposite side of the court. :whistle:


    Do you even read posts? :aww: Who the hell did compare Naz to Takeshita? I asked to name a Turkish setter than can replace Naz since someone claimed that there are many on the market, which is not true at all. Any so-called better foreign setters will cost a valuable foreign slots. Naz is a big reason why Vakıfbank is dominating against both Eczacıbaşı and Fenerbahçe. The only Turkish setter who can play in CL level other than Naz is Gamze but even her capacity is limited to a certain type of team combination (fast playing, good receiver team setting, which clearly doesn't work this season.)


    I agree that there are not many 'game changer' setters for this decade (Italian newbies Orro and Malinov are promising though). Naz is one of the few elite setter group consisting of also Ognjenoviç and Tomkom ;)

  • Do you even read posts? :aww: Who the hell did compare Naz to Takeshita? I asked to name a Turkish setter than can replace Naz since someone claimed that there are many on the market, which is not true at all. Any so-called better foreign setters will cost a valuable foreign slots. Naz is a big reason why Vakıfbank is dominating against both Eczacıbaşı and Fenerbahçe. The only Turkish setter who can play in CL level other than Naz is Gamze but even her capacity is limited to a certain type of team combination (fast playing, good receiver team setting, which clearly doesn't work this season.)


    I agree that there are not many 'game changer' setters for this decade (Italian newbies Orro and Malinov are promising though). Naz is one of the few elite setter group consisting of also Ognjenoviç and Tomkom ;)


    They don't need Naz if they could keep Zhu. :whistle:


    In my opinion... Naz staying with Vakifbank is a tragedy for Turkish NT. There's a need to reevaluate her performance under another club to see if she's still their top setter. That's what Guidetti should've done but I have no idea how much power Vakifbank still has on Guidetti. I wish he influenced her because the next time they will meet in the world championship... She doesn't have Zhu Ting to kill the ball for her when she needs her. :lol:

    Favorite players: M: Maxim Mikhaylov, Murilo, Serginho, Aaron Russell, Otavio, Simone Giannelli, Ivan Zaytsev, Tsvetan Sokolov, Michał Kubiak, Mariusz Wlazly, Pawel Zagummy W: Sheilla, Zhu Ting, Natalia, Fe Garay, Fofao, Gabi, Thaisa, Foluke Akinradewo, Wei Qiuyue, Ding Xia, Carli Lloyd, Fabi, Natalia Goncharova, Yuko Sano, Saoris Kimura and Sakoda

    Edited once, last by Rains_of_Castamere ().

  • ST2008
    You must be the one and only person left here who doesn't understand what I say since always. Last answer, then I won't repeit this anymore. I never said Zhu Ting sucks, I just said she's an all about spiking player, which is simply what I see when she plays and what stats shows. This is not the kind of players I like as OHs, so I don't like her, that's all. I've been the first who said China was going to kick everyone else's asses in the 2016 because Lang Ping built a powerhouse, while Kiraly could just talk about breathing and yoga to his players. Still Zhu Ting won more matches in one single season with Vakifbank than in her entire career with Henan. She's no God. She can't win game by herself. Whenever you take out the players who make her game comfortable, the ones who do the dark job around her, she's just a good player. Lang Ping and Guidetti know how to make her work inside a system, which means she can't go anywhere alore. In the recent years the only player I saw winning by herlself more than one game is KYK and this makes her to my eyes the best player in the world. She is the OUTSIDE HITTER. She can pass, serve, spike and digg amazingly and she's a decent blocker. Zhu Ting can't pass the ball against strong serving teams. She scores always and forever, which is something good for her team, no doubt, simply I don't like this kind of game.


    Her passing against Fenerbahce: 7 attempts, 1 error, 0% positive, 0% perfect
    Her passing against Eczacibasi: 15 attempts, 15% positive, 8% perfect

    Dude, you're so predicable. I was expecting you to bring some Zhu Ting's bad day and make your craps as an absolute fact. Probably in your mind now, one swallow does a make summer. If I follow your logic which lead to your supposed "reason" why you DON'T like Zhu Ting, you must hate the American spiker to the bone. right??


  • credits to her but i remember even the point which Simge couldnt save: 30th point of vakıf by zhu
    Simge should have saved that point and for other tough spikes : a libero is also not "dumb" and sometimes can feel where the ball will land on the court