Turkish-Kurdish Conflict Discussion

  • I don't like to talk about politics because its always ends up messy but I'm interested with this subject since there are lots of turkish posters here. I don't know if we have kurdish posters in this forum but everybody's welcome to talk if we have one. I have to say i'm not knowledgeable with the conflict so it'll be great if someone enlighten me or us to understand the whole ordeal.

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  • Ok..i think that according to erdogan and probably turkish media turkey is fighting against some terrorists (PKK) according to the west Turkey is killing Kurds and wants to help the islamic state.


    Greece is near to these countries and the atomsphere is not very good.. many people -especially nationalists/right- in sports pages of fb comment that they want death for all people in turkey...


    A left-wing party alongside with some kurds had demonstrations yesterday and burned images of erdogan and turkish flags.


    today a greek team announced a turkish volleyball player, but i dont think she will have any problem.


    Also some players of Olympiakos posted some insta story against turkish invasion.

  • It is a long story about this Turkish and Kurdish problem but this operation that has been ongoing in north Syria is not against Kurdish people but against PKK=YPG. Turkey doesnt want a terror coridor near its border and we have right for this. PKK is a terrorist group that led by Kurdish Abdullah Öcalan(he is in prison since 1998) and has been killing many people( both civilians and soldiers) in Turkey and Turkey is suffering this problem since 1980s. PKK is considered as a terrorist group by both European Union and United Nations. And we say that YPG is Syrian version of PKK that try to make a terror corridor near our border. That is it. But the whole world ignores this fact and USA(that is our ally in NATO) has been supporting this terrorist group just because they were against ISIL.

    I dont like any of Erdogans politics in Turkey, I have never voted for him but this time %90 of Turkish people support this operation. I dont know the exact number but in Turkey more than 10 million Kurdish people live and Turkey is definetely not attacking civilian Kurdish in Syria. We are hosting 4 million Syrian refugees (no other country in the world has this amount of refugee) in Turkey and definetely have right to make our border safer.

  • 4-8.jpgDuring a game between Turkey-Brazil in Greece, greek fans displayed a banner "RISE UP 4 ROJAVA - Against turkish fascism". Also i think they threw some items to turkish players.




    Many negative vibes



    Italy’s Sports Minister Vincenzo Spadafora wrote to UEFA President Aleksander Ceferin asking “to consider whether it is appropriate to keep the Champions League final in Istanbul” after Turkey’s “very grave acts against the Kurdish civilian population.”

  • not caring isnt enough when someone is throwing items because you can be injured...




    Some reactions from France


    "Thanks to the (French) federation and the police for their work to ensure the smooth running of the game," France's sports minister Roxana Maracineanu said following the game.

    "The Turkish players spoiled these efforts by doing a military salute, against sportsmanship. I ask UEFA for an exemplary sanction."


    Meanwhile, Eric Ciotti, a senior member of conservative party Les Republicains, tweeted: "The military salute of the Turkish players in solidarity with the army of #Erdogan who is killing our Kurdish allies had no place last night at the Stade de France!

    "Football does not have to be a vector of military propaganda and such infamous causes!"


    Alexis Corbiere, a senior member of populist left-wing party France Insoumise, added: "The Turkish army strikes the Kurds, murders civilians and meanwhile, in France, the players on their team salute their troops and we remain in NATO with Turkey without contesting it. In short, we're enabling it."

  • I agree on Kadir's previous message, even though I really dislike Erdogan, I support this operation since it is all about national security.


    However in today's world, if you are entering to another country's land like Turkey did, it is natural that many countries react to that (here I mean what we hear from their presidents and ministers etc). This rule applies to any country on earth, maybe slightly less for USA. I also understand that foreign media is biased and actually provoking their citizens, which explains why citizens are reacting like this (as in the case of Greece). This is all very expected and any person who is smart enough would understand why other countries and their citizens are reacting like this.


    This whole situation is difficult to explain to the western world whom did not live with a terror threat for almost 40 years. It is a very different feeling to grow up with that actually, knowing that sometimes you go to a shopping mall and a bomb explodes or someone throws a molotov coctail to a public bus that you take to work everyday. Therefore I think Turkish people would be more supportive to any other country on earth who was having terror attacks for years and now deciding to build a safety corridor in its border to stop this.


    This is also interesting considering that US actually made an operation thousands kms away to Iraq because of terror threat and their national security and now Turkey is doing the same, with an intention to build a safety corridor in 30 kms width in its border, to protect Turkish citizens living in the border as well as giving a home for Syrian refugees who are now living in Turkey.

  • The West makes no sense, I see some mistakes from our government also even in this operation however: the fact they call the PKK "Kurdish Allies" is first of all offensive to the millions of Kurds living in Turkey and also continue by saying things like "Turkey should be kicked out of NATO for this, traitors." Like WTF? You guys admit you support and fund a terrorist organization that is bombing your NATO allys', our country and causing terror that has led to Turkey not being able to move forward for years (Even Kim Hill got scared bcs of them at some point, what she needs to realize is that her country funded and armed those terrorists!!)


    But we are the traitors somehow. Isn't it crazy to fund an organization you recognise as a terrorist organization, period?


    Just bye USA.


    That some Greeks hate us no matter what is become something I got used to tbh same with the way the West is portraying our country to be Saudi Arabia while we got 0 in common.

  • I've never voted for Erdogan and I don't support his politics. But this time, like the big majority in Turkey, I support this operation.


    Turkey is a member of NATO and we can't be ok with a terrorist organization on our Syrian border.


    It doesn't matter that this terrorist organization(YPG) is supported by USA to fight againts another terrorist organization. We can't let terrorist control our border.


    It doesn't mattter that YPG members are Kurdish. It is a terrorist organization.


    In Turkey, we have 14.7 million Kurdish citizens and the Kurdish men go to military service like every Turkish male citizen. We won Independence War all together after WW1.


    Let's just imagine...A terrorist organization on UK border, but USA supports it cause it fights against ISIS. Yeah, we can't even imagine.


    All western media is against this operation, Turkey doesn't have good reputation and not good at explaining to world what actually is going on in our borders...But who cares? Our safety comes first then what westerners think.


    Ps; the idea of kicking Turkey out of NATO is just stupid and impossible cause Turkey is NATO's only access to Eastern Meditirennean. And we all know that this geographical area is the most unbalanced area in the world. Turkey will be a NATO member as long as Turkey wants.


    Ps; another funny and arrogant thing by western media is covert propaganda against Turkish Football NT's soldier salute. French Captain, Greizmann, has done it. Cristiano Ronaldo has done it. It was even on FIFA video games...But when Turkish guys do it, it becames a problem. LOL. Another fascist and racist day in Europe. Nothing shocking.

  • I don't like Erdogan and his policy and I've never before vote for his party. But I support Turkish Armed forces. ( State ≠ Goverments). Turkey facing terror attacks 40 years. And now Turkey facing since 2011 Syrian crisis. Erdogan's Syrian policy is awful so Turkey hosting 3,6 Syrian asylumseeker. Turkish people don't want live together with Syrian asylumseeker. Our operation's has two purpose: 1) Turkey, on our borderline doesn't want a terrorist state ( Turkish-Syrian border lenght is 911 km)

    2) Turkey wants to send some of the asylumseekers to safe zones to be established

    And Turkish operation against Terror groups, not Kurdish people. And Turkish people don't have any problem with Kurdish people. ( example from myself.) *Our paternal side is ethnic Turkic and my aunt [my father's sister(hala in Turkish)] will married a guy Kurdish roots from southestern Mardin Province.

    And Turkey don't slaughter to Kurdish PEOPLE. Even Donald Trump says American channels are lying news. https://twitter.com/realDonald…/1184579045138337794?s=19


  • For the record: I never said I did but just to make it clear; I don't actually 'support' this operation of course and I highly doubt 90% does, it may look like I did when put along with other posts! And the reason is a very long story but not what the West is talking about.


    Just so you can see it from another perspective put shortly: apparently ISIS is a 100% destroyed, so you guys truly believe that's it? We're forever saved? Of course not! As long as still a big chunk of people believe in their ways (and that chunk is there) as long as the mindset is still there, we will see many more ISIS'es, Al Qaeda's, Taliban's, Islamic States' etc.


    Violence + Violence = not equal to peace! Sure, you might eliminate some direct threats. But what happens mostly in wars is lost lives of civillians (even if you don't target them its gonna happen) and more trauma. Moving 2 million Syrians back to Syria will make the EU countries very happy too, less immigrants to host. But how humane will the process be, where will the Kurdish civillians move to that were there? Peace starts from within! But Erdogan and the fascist groups like MHP make that hard.


    Turkey indeed doesn't target civillians like the West claims and there is proof to that, so propaganda indeed is just bs like the one about what will happen if Turkey massacres all Syrian Kurds... Like wtf? 14/83 is about +- 17% of the Turkish soldiers are likely Kurdish themselves! This is not about Kurdish people but terrorists! People must understand that. They are globally recognized as terrorists as well as in the USA and the EU. And Turkey do have a right to defend their borders when the entire NATO backstabbed them and made their country turn into a danger zone! Personally I just would never support a war and don't believe it fixes much at all, but the motives of Turkey are not invalid at all, Turkey has a right to defend its country! It surprises me how scandalously all EU countries and the USA call groups they recognize as terrorists as allies. I hope Turkey will get rid of the EU and never approach them again after the Erdogan regime, never seen such 'traitors' tbh... How can we work along with people that fund and arm terrorists to bomb our country, its sick.

  • I don't like to talk about politics because its always ends up messy but I'm interested with this subject since there are lots of turkish posters here. I don't know if we have kurdish posters in this forum but everybody's welcome to talk if we have one. I have to say i'm not knowledgeable with the conflict so it'll be great if someone enlighten me or us to understand the whole ordeal.

    The conflict is due to the fact that Turkey doesn't want an autonomous Kurdish region next to their borders. After so many years of oppression and torture towards Kurdish people, Turkey is afraid that Kurdish region Rojava will inspire millions of Kurds living in Turkey.


    the most hypocrytical part is that, after criticizing USA for interfering Iraq for 'national security' for many years, now turkey is using the same excuse to attack towards Kurdish region. Turkey clearly considers Kurdish autonomy as a threat and call it 'national security issue'.


    The supporters of the Kurdish movement in Turkey has been imprisoned for a long time. They have been called as terrorist. meanwhile, democratically elected Kurdish leaders were removed from their positions, giving no area to survive for Kurds and defend their culture.


    Kurdish soldiers have been fighting against ISIS for a long time. However, according to recent media reports hundreds of captured members of ISIS had escaped from prisons in Syria after the Kurds moved forces to the Syrian border to meet Turkey's assault. Turkey's attack towards Kurds only helps ISIS to re-emerge

  • It's good to hear also that perspective. :thumbup: it's why I said peace starts from within! As long as we continue opressing and discriminating against the Kurds, the mindset won't change. Even Spain is doing the same to the Catalans and in 2019 people on both sides should stand against such acts.


    But the PKK are still a huge threat for Turkey and this shouldn't be considered the only way for Kurds. Even Trump said, "PKK fighters might be even worse than ISIS themselves!" I like the new generations approach with rise of politicians like Ekrem Imamoglu, that could unite this country again. It's whats needed, not the AKP and MHPs radical nationalist ways.


    I agree definitely HDP elected leaders should be put back in office and Demirtaş should be freed. The Kurds in Turkey need actions not words. They just as any group have the right to represent themselves in the government. Yes they can live a normal life in Turkey, but I can imagine it can feel like being 2nd class citizens too and lately it has gone too far when your representstives even get pulled from their jobs...


    It was also my concern. I see AKP say we stand against PKK/YPG which I agree are terrorist groups and then I see them put 5 other Kurdish political parties all over the world and add HDP to that and I'm like stop. Basically every single Kurdish power is a threat... Just no.


    The ISIS part is a bit of a mess, but we'll see what the Turkish forces will do truly on upcoming days, many people report something else. Many say ISIS is already done, but tbh the mindset is still out there. Even with the Syrian rebels!

  • Do you really compare these two things and see it as it is the same:obey:? USA forces coming mileees away to Iraq with 'fighting against terrorist' and Turkey forces fighting with PKK/YPG right behind its border with Syria(which is 900 kilometers)? I can respect your opinion if you are not considering YPG as terrorist but these two occasions arent comparable for me.


    The other thing with your saying Kurdish movements supporters being imprisoned is totally different for me. Of course I have no problem with Kurdish parliamenterians in parliament(they definetely should be in there) but the problem is some of Kurdish parliaments from HDP officially and publicly shows their interests and sympathy to PKK. I believe that is the reason why they are imprisoned, not because of their being Kurdish.Otherwise HDP(which is Kurdish nationalist party being the 3rd biggest party in parliament) wouldnt be there from the very begining and they wouldnt be allowed to participate to elections. The problem in Turkey is not the Kurdish people themselves but the terrorist PKK. I just cant imagine a parliamenterian in USA wouldnt be imprisoned if they show their interest for example ISIS or some other terrorist group like Al Qaeda or Taliban.

  • Do you really compare these two things and see it as it is the same:obey:? USA forces coming mileees away to Iraq with 'fighting against terrorist' and Turkey forces fighting with PKK/YPG right behind its border with Syria(which is 900 kilometers)? I can respect your opinion if you are not considering YPG as terrorist but these two occasions arent comparable for me.


    The other thing with your saying Kurdish movements supporters being imprisoned is totally different for me. Of course I have no problem with Kurdish parliamenterians in parliament(they definetely should be in there) but the problem is some of Kurdish parliaments from HDP officially and publicly shows their interests and sympathy to PKK. I believe that is the reason why they are imprisoned, not because of their being Kurdish.Otherwise HDP(which is Kurdish nationalist party being the 3rd biggest party in parliament) wouldnt be there from the very begining and they wouldnt be allowed to participate to elections. The problem in Turkey is not the Kurdish people themselves but the terrorist PKK. I just cant imagine a parliamenterian in USA wouldnt be imprisoned if they show their interest for example ISIS or some other terrorist group like Al Qaeda or Taliban.

    Are you kidding me? Can't believe you're thinking you're being smart atm. Turkey is still outside it's border just like the USA. What surprises me is that you think it's justified to imprison people for who'm they feel sympathy with or simply for what they think without them acting out on radicalism. You should learn something about what democracy and law truly means outside of Turkish sources. You can't imprison people for thinking lmao and when you do do that it's scary to think where the limit is and who defines it which is why at some point everyone got called terrorists, even CHP voters. People that haven't comitted a crime, can't be imprisoned. It's simple logic. Otherwise why don't we imprison the millions of muslims that still today feel sympathy for ISIS!


    And let's also agree it's very debatable what AKP today calls having 'sympathy' for. These days we are all terrorists if it is up to them.


    Turkish people should learn again about the principles of rule of law. Atatürk tried to teach us but it seems we have long forgotten it.

  • Do you really compare these two things and see it as it is the same:obey:? USA forces coming mileees away to Iraq with 'fighting against terrorist' and Turkey forces fighting with PKK/YPG right behind its border with Syria(which is 900 kilometers)? I can respect your opinion if you are not considering YPG as terrorist but these two occasions arent comparable for me.


    The other thing with your saying Kurdish movements supporters being imprisoned is totally different for me. Of course I have no problem with Kurdish parliamenterians in parliament(they definetely should be in there) but the problem is some of Kurdish parliaments from HDP officially and publicly shows their interests and sympathy to PKK. I believe that is the reason why they are imprisoned, not because of their being Kurdish.Otherwise HDP(which is Kurdish nationalist party being the 3rd biggest party in parliament) wouldnt be there from the very begining and they wouldnt be allowed to participate to elections. The problem in Turkey is not the Kurdish people themselves but the terrorist PKK. I just cant imagine a parliamenterian in USA wouldnt be imprisoned if they show their interest for example ISIS or some other terrorist group like Al Qaeda or Taliban.

    No matter how far you are coming from, invading another country's soil is wrong. Imagine Iran would invade our east border and claim that there are terrorist activity going on and it is a threat to their national security, then do you think this would be an justified assault?


    About terrorism part, the thing most Turkish people turn a blind eye to is that Turkish governments made their own terrorist themselves! Most of the PKK soldiers are children of people whom tortured by Turkish police/soldiers during 80s and 90s. Imagine you are a minority living in a different country, and your parents are being tortured, discriminated, humiliated by the police and soldiers, how would you have felt? For many decades, people claimed that Kurdish nation even doesn't exist! Thousands of civilians were killed, tortured just because they want to speak their own language.


    Calling a group of people as terrorist is very easy nowadays, as long as there is a conflict of interest, people can name each other terrorist. Even Mandela and his supporters were recognized as terrorists before. You could be called as terrorist while others call you freedom fighters.

  • The Kurds have been terribly discriminated in the past indeed, we can't ignore that and it's not okay. Today it is much better but the pain is still there. If we truly want to move on and be stronger together, we have to acknowledge and condemn what happened and fully stop discriminating but it won't happen. Even in this forum people still look at the problems so one-sided.


    Kudos to you for admitting it at least it shows your intelligence, sometimes I feel afraid even to admit it because of social pressure... For now only people from CHP recently are approaching it the right way (while they also have bad history on this issue) and understand the problems finally and Erdogan did do some good in early 2000s but not now. It's why I really hope 2023 (or before) will be the CHP's year. It can allow Turkey to finally start fresh. We need progressives to rule this country, people that care about education, culture, humanity, democracy and law before all but it all starts from our own living room! And how we start thinking differently.

  • Left-wing parties were considered the most turkish-friendly part of greek society and generally in europe. But after the last developments this has changed a lot.



    A Greek anarchist group raised a banner on the grounds of the Kemal Ataturk Museum.

    Museum guards and Greek police officers quickly removed the protesters and detained twelve of them.

    Also they did something similar to the Turkish Airlines "area" in a greek airport.


    Juventus fans asked the team to fire Demiral after the salute but the president of the team said that he will remain in the team.


    In Germany one soccer player showed his support via his instagram to the turkish army and his club fired him.


    Today Olympiacos handball team ended its collaboration with Turkish player Ali Tinkir, bacause he celebrated with salute in a game of his NT.