Italy - Serie A1 2020/21

    It is really annoying, because Novara had realistic chances to get a win: mediocre reception, Hill playing really bad offensively, no middles at all in a game for Imoco all night long, Smarzek playing really solid, Daalderop receiving really well, Novara's OHs outplaying their vis a vis, good performance from their MBs - and yet they wasted all the chances they had in 2-3 sets, and that's something that Paola Egonu doesn't forgive. I don't think they'll have another shot to get a win in this series.


    I don't like the way Conegliano plays those crucial games in Italian competition this season, they are fortunate enough to have Egonu who has played out of this world in Coppa Italia or this game, but in reality, middles, sets distribution, reception and OHs performances are really shaky in those games. Sometimes, Imoco still looks like this untouchable team where everything works great (SFs against Novara in CL), but in like 50% of important matches this year (Coppa Italia, first game against Scandicci in CL or this one) Imoco wins because they have a single individual that outperforms anyone who's on the other side of a net, and not because they're a perfect machine with all elements working really well. Obviously, it's really hard to criticize a team that can realistically win every game in a season and win all trophies possible, but right now in many occasions they're more like Egonu's Novara with a better setter and a libero, so they may be upset anytime Egonu has a weaker day. Fortunately enough, she has no weak day all season long.


    39/66, an ace and 7 blocks, this is a clear reminiscence of some Egonu's performances in Novara two seasons ago in terms of volume of spikes and an one-dimensional style of play. And it's not like in Coppa Italia it looked that much different, Sylla had a great final performance, and that's it.


    To be honest, I'm confident in saying that Egonu will get more help during NT season than this season since January.

    It's weird, you know. We keep reading the exact opposite of what you just wrote every damn day, in every damn topic. By reading your post, I think your nickname really suits you. :thumbup:


    I only disagree on something: is Wolosz actually better than Carlini? I remember her first season in Busto very well and she sucked. I remember on another forum people used to think she belonged to A2 at best and she couldn't be Lloyd's heir, because she was too weak (her second season was definitely better, but nothing unforgettable). Not to mention her NT performance are nothing more than average. She has never played as good as she does in Imoco. In Chemik Police she was often benched for Belcik, probably the most criticized setter in the history of polish women's volleyball... She proved nothing far from Conegliano, literally. :/

    I agree with you at 100%, but I think there is something that we are missing to point out: it was thanks to Novara performance, to this almost perfect display that the Piemontese team showed that forced Conegliano to play as Egonu Vball Club style. Despite of the wasted chances in 2nd and 3rd set, the childish unforgivebale mistakes done, Novara tried their best in order to make Conegliano looks as a one dimensional team. They forced the service in order to break Conegliano reception, as well as Novara defence was super ready for Robin slides (she was dug so so so many times, finished with a poor 22%), as well as they just cancelled Hill/Adams. This is a huge merit of Novara. Conegliano plan wasnt to just set to Egonu every single ball like it has happened in other matches, they were forced to do it.

    I remember that in Coppa Italia , some Novara players said that Conegliano was all about Egonu. So in CL SFs, Conegliano unleashed such a a class of pure vball: good transitions, using Egonu to pull the block, every single spiker was contributing, superb floor defence, etc. They played as well oiled machine, without holes: they shut Novara players mouths after that SFs play off.


    Once again, it is a huge merit of Novara to put Conegliano between the strings. Few teams have done in the last 2 years. They also did a good job in order to make Wolosz lose her head in some parts of the match (as well as Novara did childish mistakes, cuz of shaky reception and nervous, Wolosz many times put more speed in her sets when there was no need, she was wanted to finish the point). And we know that if you are able to pull Wolosz out of the match, more than the 50% of the job is done in order to beat Conegliano or a team where she is (for example, the match against Scandicci + Poland x Turkey for Tokyo ticket).

    But at the end, if things dont work in your side and you have a star in your team, you only have to activate her.

    As you said, I highly doubt Novara would be able to pull such a performance as the one of tonight. I hope they prove me wrong.

    Hill is well known for choking in all the finals, unless Alisha Glass sets and leaves her free from the blockers (2014 WCH).


    Imoco had crazy good passing tonight, according to the stats: 60% positive and 44% perfect.

    Hill and Adams both over 50% perfect, De Gennaro almost there with 47%.


    AGIL was even better, but raised by Chirichella's 100% perfect on 2 attempts.

    Quote from QPL

    It's weird, you know. We keep reading the exact opposite of what you just wrote every damn day, in every damn topic. By reading your post, I think your nickname really suits you. :thumbup:


    I only disagree on something: is Wolosz actually better than Carlini? I remember her first season in Busto very well and she sucked. I remember on another forum people used to think she belonged to A2 at best and she couldn't be Lloyd's heir, because she was too weak (her second season was definitely better, but nothing unforgettable). Not to mention her NT performance are nothing more than average. She has never played as good as she does in Imoco. In Chemik Police she was often benched for Belcik, probably the most criticized setter in the history of polish women's volleyball... She proved nothing far from Conegliano, literally. :/

    I think Wolosz works very, very well in Imoco's system. When she plays well she can make it look very easy and leave her hitters 1 vs 1 with great speed time and time again. I don't think Carlini or anyone else (with the possible exception of Ognjenovic) could do her job to that level.


    But then I also agree with you. I've not seen anything from her at Busto, Chemik or the NT to suggest she's anything more than a solid setter. So for me she's a great choice for Imoco and has been a big part of the great team they've had over the past few years but looking more generally I'm not sure she's a great setter overall. On the other hand, who is a truly great setter these days?

    Wołosz is a really great player for Conegliano, but it is kinda irrelevant when other players don't play their best, she's not a magician. De Kruijf, Folie and Fahr had injury issues, so they don't play their best constantly this season (Fahr is probably the most consistent throughout a season), Sylla has always been streaky and Hill is really incosistent on offense these days.


    Theoretically, Conegliano has the best player in the world, the best libero, the best trio on MB position in Italy, a great setter and really good OH duo, as well as a great bench.


    In reality, in some games they played their best and crush opponents, but in some Egonu has no help from OHs, and MBs are no alternative for Wołosz, who plays kinda shaky ball. It was a case during Coppa Italia tournament, so was it today.


    And there are still moments when Conegliano plays their best and that's a pure joy to watch (SFs against Novara and Scandicci, first part of a season), but regularly there are moments, where Egonu is like a lonely island on a court. That's why I'm not so sure that Conegliano will win a CL, although they're favorites to do so. If the second version arrives on a court, they're certainly beatable.


    Leonardo.D


    1st leg against Scandicci:

    Sylla 7/26, Hill 10/29, De Kruijf & Butigan 5 points, Folie 14 points

    Egonu 38 points


    QF of Coppa Italia against Busto:

    Hill 11/22, Sylla 11/28, De Kruijf 5 points, Folie 5 points

    Egonu 40 points


    Final of Coppa Italia against Novara:

    De Kruijf 13 points, Folie 6 points, Hill 6/24, Sylla 20/36

    Egonu 35 points


    1st leg against Novara in league finals:

    De Kruijf 6 points, Fahr 9 points, Hill 8/30, Sylla 16/39

    Egonu 47 points


    I agree that Novara played really well today and I don't want to downplay their performance, but I think Conegliano issues are clearly ''internal'', it is a matter of shape of Hill and MBs since December. When both middles play great and OH duo is a great support for Egonu, Imoco is almost unbeatable. But there were several occasions past few weeks in important games where MBs and/or OHs didn't play their best, and Scandicci, Busto or Novara had realistic chances to beat Imoco - but then Egonu arrived and scored 35-40 points or more on ridiculous efficiency. Vakifbank has enough potential and power to overcome Conegliano in a version where Egonu needs to score 40 points or more, Novara - unfortunately no, because they had two occasions to do so and they failed, especially today it was a really bad choking.


    And again, I don't criticize Conegliano, because they're certain;y one of the best teams we've seen in some time, but there are two versions of this team: the first one that plays perfect ball team-wise with all elements functioning really well, and the second that plays one dimensional volleyball and beats its opponents because of Egonu's presence. And I think we've seen the second version far too often past few weeks.


    That's why I think Egonu may get more help in Italian NT than in Conegliano, despite a fact that Malinov isn't remotely close to be as good as Wołosz: Bosetti is more consistent player than Hill at this stage of their careers, and I guess middles (no matter who's gonna to be chosen by Mazzanti) can play much better than Conegliano's MBs in many important games.

    Quote from Sisko95

    I think Wolosz works very, very well in Imoco's system. When she plays well she can make it look very easy and leave her hitters 1 vs 1 with great speed time and time again. I don't think Carlini or anyone else (with the possible exception of Ognjenovic) could do her job to that level.


    But then I also agree with you. I've not seen anything from her at Busto, Chemik or the NT to suggest she's anything more than a solid setter. So for me she's a great choice for Imoco and has been a big part of the great team they've had over the past few years but looking more generally I'm not sure she's a great setter overall. On the other hand, who is a truly great setter these days?

    I think Wolosz has more creativity than Carlini. That's for sure. But she's also very dependent of the quality of the passing. She's a good system setter.


    Carlini is more that kind of setter you tell her what you want her to do and she gets the job done (same as Poulter, that's something many USA setters have, including Glass). She has also amazing defensive skills and a physical power very uncommon (she can run the whole game to set the ball, which is what happened all season long in THY, and never get tired; and she has the strength to jump and save the overpass at eight other setters can't reach). And I just noticed Scandicci had its best season when she was their setter (2nd place in RS and play-off SFs). They have always been 4/5th with Malinov. AGIL won CL title with her. THY with the historic upset over Eczacibasi + win against Vakifbank...


    Anyway, I agree. Right now I think the best setters in the world are quite basic players compared to Venturini, Fofao, Lo Bianco, Kun Feng, Takeshita, Kirillova... Even the marvelous Ognjenovic had a nightmare season when she first came to Italy about 15 years ago, compared to other setters in the league at the time...

    It's really helpful when you have someone like eguno or Boskovic or haak or even zhu who can lead the team but there is also a disadvantages like other players aren't really dedicated in scoring because they have this mindset that they have someone who can score and i don't like it. That's what happened to this match, imoco won, but i felt like novara deserves to win this match than imoco because they really play all as a team and give it all.


    Italy has big chance in making it to the finals and even win the vnl and olympic woth how these local players playing and plus they have a super talented eguno who can carry the team.

    I've also mentioned about this before. Wolosz is useful only in particular team setting which is exactly what Conegliano has (similar to Glass for example) this kind of setters can shine a lot in a team with solid reception and fast players but they don't show anything special out of that environment (i.e polish NT) That's why I find more versatile setters like Ognjenoviç, Naz, Carlini more since they have been successful in various type of teams consisting of different style of players.

    Quote from serdar

    I've also mentioned about this before. Wolosz is useful only in particular team setting which is exactly what Conegliano has (similar to Glass for example) this kind of setters can shine a lot in a team with solid reception and fast players but they don't show anything special out of that environment (i.e polish NT) That's why I find more versatile setters like Ognjenoviç, Naz, Carlini more since they have been successful in various type of teams consisting of different style of players.

    Carlini flopped in Russia but we can forgive that. She's a lucky charm, her teams always make to places that no one expected

    Oh God people are really comparing messy Carlini with Wolosz :gone::gone::sos::sos:

    I really don't get it that people from this forum, people's who knows that volleyball is team sport and how much every player is important for the game and they are still comparing individuals performance of players from their NT to clubs performance. :aww:


    In NT you DON'T choose with who you can play, Wolosz and Haak are not guilty because they are born in Poland and Sweden and that they don't have great team players around them in there home country. Poland is rising yes, but they are not even near Italy, Serbia, China, Brazil, USA when it is comes to pool of great players.

    Put Wolosz in Italy and there would be 1.05 odds that they are gone won Gold at Olympics.


    Wolosz hasn't LOSE SINGLE MATCH 79 MATCHES IN THE ROW WITH CONEGLIANO. One less than Egonu.


    Right know you can't compare her with Carlini or Naz in your dreams (who is btw playing TERRIBLE in Fenerbahce with her ceiling high sets, I repeat right now so that you don't twist my words)) And because She started to set ceiling high sets She is versatile setter, No She is not She is terrible with that type of the game.

    That is why She didn't won anything and She needs to come back to her fast system setting where She is GREAT and showing how great setter She is.

    Big congrats to both Wolosz and Egonu. One of the best diagonals in the history of volleyball.


    They won 79/80 victories IN THE ROW. I think this is something that no one has done it in history of volleyball :white::super::flower:

    Wołosz will never win here, no matter what.

    When she's trying to do something extra and not set to the leader in crucial moments - she's the one to blame, because it's 'unnecessary' and she should choose wise. When almost the whole team is playing awful and she sets to the leader she's boring and nothing special. The girl can't win.


    It's funny to me that Carlini is now better than Wołosz :gone:


    @QLP - I'll be honest with you, you are the most biased person here. You'll always defend your faves, even when they play awful. I remember how many times you critistisied Skorupa when she was playing in Conegliano. Whenever Robinson or Fawcett played horrible it was always Kasia's fault, because her sets were 'unkillable' . It was always like that. Everyone has their faves, but in the end of the day you can always criticise them too.


    It's always someone to blame instead of your faves, always...





    When Egonu was playing in Novara she never had % like this and she was getting high amount of balls every match despite that in the team were players like Bartsch, Piccinini and one of the best attacking MB Velijkovic.


    Suddenly people act here like Wołosz had only good matches in Imoco and her blocking and defense is simply weak. 😘

    If Novara wouldn’t wasted all those opportunities, they would have won in straight sets but more importantly, they would have physiological superiority which could work in their favor in the upcoming matches. Imoco showed again that even in their bad days, they could still win so I am not sure if we are going to see same kind of matches again because Imoco will have the upper hand. I hope I will be wrong because I don’t want to see another match where Novara surrenders to Imoco easily. I also don’t really care for that winning streak. I didn’t care when Vakif had it either. It is sports, it is fun when unpredictable happens. And a defeat would do good for Imoco because I feel it causes unnecessary tension because of that winning streak.

    as for Wolosz being best setter, it is nothing but a product of good marketing. Just like Gozde Kirdar 🙄:whistle:

    Totally Agree with you

    What is this all about?:what:


    Yesterday only Egonu played great for Conegliano (can she even play a bad match at the moment?:white:). Fahr played decent. Sylla had some good moments, but also some really bad ones. Even De Gennaro didn't play at her usual level. All of; Hill, de Kruijf and Wolosz just played bad. However, every team or player can have a bad match once in a while...

    Although I do agree that there is some kind of pattern when Conegliano plays a bad match and that is: Wolosz. In important matches she has poor decision making and her sets are imprecise. With this, she destroys the confidence of a lot players and eventually stops using them at all. On the other hand, can we blame her by overusing the best player on court? Wouldn't any setter do that in the most important and decisive moments...

    Also claiming she isn't anything special as a setter, because she didn't play well in Busto and Chemik Police, is just nonsense! For example, if you only look at the level Sloëtjes showed in Busto and Scandicci compared to her performance in Vakifbank and Dutch NT, you wouldn't say she was a good opposite either.

    I think no other setter in the world could do the same thing in Conegliano as Wolosz did, so I think that makes her special and a good setter!^^